[Mesa-users] atm options

Mon Sep 4 23:21:29 UTC 2023

Hi Anwesha,

(cc-ing mesa-users back in. I accidentally responded from the wrong email address and I think that may have dropped us off the mailing list. My bad.)

Regarding adding old options back in, I'd encourage you to comment on the open github issue (https://github.com/MESAHub/mesa/issues/583 <https://github.com/MESAHub/mesa/issues/583>) to help us decide whether we just need to clean up the documentation to get rid of them or if we want to try reviving those options and making them available to users again.

Others on the mailing list can probably help you with your question about implementing your own atmosphere in run_star_extras.

Cheers,
Evan

> On Sep 4, 2023, at 6:46 PM, Biswas, Anwesha [PHYSA] <anwesha at iastate.edu> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Evan,
> 
> There were 2 old options which are now discontinued (1. Paczynski grey as atm option, 2. wd_surf_at_tau_1m4 test suite) which used to treat low optical depths for white dwarfs. Is there a chance that they can be revived back? 
> 
> if not, then can there be a way in which I can incorporate in run_star_extras.f90 that it runs a check,
> 
> a loop iterated over gridpoints k from surface to center, checks the sign of Brunt Vaisala, at every grid for each model. The first grid where it finds it to be negative, it turns on atm_option --> T_tau Eddington grey, sets the outer atmosphere boundary to a desired value controlled by x_ctrl in the cooling inlist, and adds the atmosphere structure to the corresponding pulse profile format file. The interior is still computed using table atmospheres and controlled from the inlists atmosphere option
> 
> Thank you very much for all the help.
> 
> Anwesha
> From: Evan Bauer <evan.bauer at cfa.harvard.edu>
> Sent: Monday, September 4, 2023 5:28:00 PM
> To: Biswas, Anwesha [PHYSA] <anwesha at iastate.edu>
> Cc: mesa-users <mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org>
> Subject: Re: [Mesa-users] atm options
>  
> Hi Anwesha,
> 
> Unfortunately it sounds like MESA might not include enough physics to get at what you're after. If the tabulated atmospheres make an important difference in the properties of the surface convective zone that can't be recovered when using other atm optoins, then you simply won't be able to use MESA to also resolve the regions of low optical depth outside of the boundary condition where MESA attaches to the tables at tau=25.
> 
> However, the atmosphere models used to tabulate the boundary conditions might contain more information that could be useful to you. I'd start with this paper to see how much more detail might be available about the atmosphere models outside the boundary conditions where stellar models get attached: https://ui.adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2012A%26A...546A.119R/abstract <https://www.google.com/url?q=https://ui.adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2012A%26A...546A.119R/abstract&source=gmail-imap&ust=1694472389000000&usg=AOvVaw3jVLuuRggyqz0aCh35vHxF>
> 
> Cheers,
> Evan
> 
> 
>> On Aug 31, 2023, at 1:37 PM, Biswas, Anwesha [PHYSA] via Mesa-users <mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org <mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I am looking at the outbursting DAVs. The region from base of the convection zone to the photosphere is important in this regard to see how the energy of the mode behaves. I am using WD table atmospheres but that puts the first model grid to tau=25. Is there any way possible to put the first model grid to tau=0.1
>> I have tried relaxing the tau factor and setting tau_factor = 0.15 which will put the first model grid to 0.1 optical depth with Eddington grey atmosphere while cooling the white dwarf. But then the result is very different from WD_table atmospheres regarding the location of the base of the convection zone
>> a table atmosphere give the base at log(P)~9
>> a Eddington grey atmosphere give the base at log(P)~14
>> 
>> is there any way to work around this so that I have the result similar to wd table atmospheres while getting the first model grid to tau~0.1 or even less values
>> 
>> Anwesha
>> 
>> 
>> ________________________________________
>> From: Biswas, Anwesha [PHYSA] <anwesha at iastate.edu <mailto:anwesha at iastate.edu>>
>> Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2023 11:34
>> To: Kawaler, Steven [PHYSA]
>> Subject: Fwd: [Mesa-users] atm options
>> 
>> Do you think we should include it again?
>> 
>> Anwesha
>> ________________________________
>> From: Evan Bauer <evan.bauer.astro at gmail.com <mailto:evan.bauer.astro at gmail.com>>
>> Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2023 11:31:20 AM
>> To: Ebraheem Farag <ekfarag at asu.edu <mailto:ekfarag at asu.edu>>
>> Cc: Biswas, Anwesha [PHYSA] <anwesha at iastate.edu <mailto:anwesha at iastate.edu>>; mesa-users <mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org <mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org>>
>> Subject: Re: [Mesa-users] atm options
>> 
>> Hi All,
>> 
>> Eb is right that the Paczynski_grey atmosphere option has been removed entirely from recent versions of MESA. As far as I can tell, the most recent release in which that option was functional was r11701. You can see a bit more discussion on the github issue Eb just opened here<https://github.com/MESAHub/mesa/issues/583 <https://www.google.com/url?q=https://github.com/MESAHub/mesa/issues/583&source=gmail-imap&ust=1694472389000000&usg=AOvVaw0yphNJbyepBHv5id11Qb-j>>. We'll get the documentation cleaned up to make this much more clear. Sorry about that!
>> 
>> If there's a compelling reason to reintroduce this atmosphere option into MESA releases, we could possibly try to revive it. But given that this atmosphere option was apparently broken since 2019, and then removed altogether in 2021, and the issue hasn't surfaced on mesa-users until now, it's not clear whether there's really much demand for this particular option. Happy for anyone to chime in if you feel differently though!
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Evan
>> 
>> On Aug 31, 2023, at 10:47 AM, Ebraheem Farag via Mesa-users <mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org <mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org><mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org <mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org>>> wrote:
>> 
>> I'm sorry Anwsha, as far as I can tell this is a documentation bug and the option seems to be removed entirely in the current MESA version.
>> 
>> Perhaps an eddington T-tau relation or table atmosphere will be sufficient for your use case?
>> 
>> -EbF
>> 
>> On Thu, Aug 31, 2023 at 7:08 AM Biswas, Anwesha [PHYSA] <anwesha at iastate.edu <mailto:anwesha at iastate.edu><mailto:anwesha at iastate.edu <mailto:anwesha at iastate.edu>>> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> This is the change I have made in inlist_common of ‘make_co_wd’ (I am loading a zams model and running from inlist_to_end_he_core_burn)
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>  atm_option = 'Paczynski_grey' !'T_tau'
>> 
>>      !Paczynski_atm_R_surf_errtol = 3d-4
>> 
>>      !atm_build_errtol = 3d-4
>> 
>>      !atm_build_dlogtau = 0.1
>> 
>>      !atm_build_tau_outer = 0.1
>> 
>>      !atm_T_tau_relation = 'Eddington'
>> 
>>      !atm_T_tau_opacity = 'varying'
>> 
>>      !atm_T_tau_max_steps = 1000
>> 
>>      use_T_tau_gradr_factor = .true.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Unknown value for atm_option: Paczynski_grey
>> 
>> DATE: 2023-08-31
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> If I am activating the second option it says cannot match namelist.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Is there a way out to get this to work? Thank you for all the help.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Anwesha
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: Ebraheem Farag <ekfarag at asu.edu <mailto:ekfarag at asu.edu><mailto:ekfarag at asu.edu <mailto:ekfarag at asu.edu>>>
>> Date: Wednesday, August 30, 2023 at 23:32
>> To: Biswas, Anwesha [PHYSA] <anwesha at iastate.edu <mailto:anwesha at iastate.edu><mailto:anwesha at iastate.edu <mailto:anwesha at iastate.edu>>>
>> Cc: mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org <mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org><mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org <mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org>> <mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org <mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org><mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org <mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org>>>
>> Subject: Re: [Mesa-users] atm options
>> 
>> Yes, see
>> 
>> https://docs.mesastar.org/en/latest/atm/overview.html<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://docs.mesastar.org/en/latest/atm/overview.html__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!YVvPiwL0JaS4diKBF2AnnFmYce_RskLURJ0He4AKMXeIsRvB_QYFV3TRqd0EkI4q9dsOWBha8o0a_1Nf_w$> <https://www.google.com/url?q=https://docs.mesastar.org/en/latest/atm/overview.html%3Chttps://urldefense.com/v3/__https://docs.mesastar.org/en/latest/atm/overview.html__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!YVvPiwL0JaS4diKBF2AnnFmYce_RskLURJ0He4AKMXeIsRvB_QYFV3TRqd0EkI4q9dsOWBha8o0a_1Nf_w$%3E&source=gmail-imap&ust=1694472389000000&usg=AOvVaw2Hz-rHJ6uq9mi4dmZFRsS9>
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -EbF
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Wed, Aug 30, 2023 at 10:31 PM Biswas, Anwesha [PHYSA] via Mesa-users <mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org<mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hello,
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Does atm_option = 'Paczynski_grey' still a valid choice in mesa?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Anwesha
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org<mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org>
>> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://lists.mesastar.org/mailman/listinfo/mesa-users__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fcvQvddJfngOK3eaY9jX1EARM7EaUMi2nlSl0sFNLoxYiOx7qws-ojkgAyZ1gz8KpApxAXulyEvlvxGNZJS4atcn$<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/lists.mesastar.org/mailman/listinfo/mesa-users__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!fcvQvddJfngOK3eaY9jX1EARM7EaUMi2nlSl0sFNLoxYiOx7qws-ojkgAyZ1gz8KpApxAXulyEvlvxGNZJS4atcn$>
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org<mailto:mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org>
>> https://lists.mesastar.org/mailman/listinfo/mesa-users
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> mesa-users at lists.mesastar.org
>> https://lists.mesastar.org/mailman/listinfo/mesa-users

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <https://lists.mesastar.org/pipermail/mesa-users/attachments/20230904/177b86d3/attachment.htm>